Written by: Spirals | Date: 2012-04-25 10:35:00 | Related to: Diablo 3 PvP

News from diablo.incgamers.com

"Another blue commented on PvP, which we’ve been told will not be enabled upon launch, but will be added in at some later date. Most everyone who played the Arena demo at the last two Blizzcons loved it and can’t see any reason the devs don’t enable something much like the 2011 deathmatch demo, in the full game upon launch. As Blizzard hasn’t given any official explanation for the delay beyond a generic “more polishing,” there are two main fan theories:

1) Blizzard saw how much fans loved playing the Arena, realized the potential of the system, and they now want to launch it in a more balanced and polished form that they’ll gradually transition to an E-Sport.

2) Blizzard doesn’t think D3′s PvP is noob-friendly or accessible enough and wants to put in more “gold star just for trying” WoW-style achievements.

Neither theory gets any support from Zarhym’s nonspecific comments today, which could have been presented 6, 12, or 18 months ago without a single word being changed."

"We want PvP to be incredibly challenging and fun, but we want to avoid turning it into a truly competitive leagues/ladders eSport. We just don’t think Diablo gameplay is very conducive for that type of controlled environment where balance is paramount.

We want to develop PvP as an engaging and rewarding system. What we don’t want to do is take a traditional eSports approach to PvP, where balance will become so important to a competitive ranking system that solo and cooperative gameplay feel a bit neutered as a result.

We want your characters to feel totally imba. Then we want you to enter some Arenas, send the scorched remains of other players’ corpses flying, and let the satisfaction wash over you — until your opponents take similar care of your hero, that is."

source

Because of this news we will continue to build our community and website more strongly so we are good prepared for when the PvP gets released..

Comments

Pat	2012-04-25 11:10
Yep, still I hope they'll add the possibility for custom duels. Btw, this is from Jay Wilson's Q&A: [quote] Is the Arena you are developing a lot different from the one we saw at Blizzcon 2011? What about just regular field PvP and other PvP methods? There are changes to the Arena compared to the blizzcon version but it won’t be too different. We excluded PVP simply because it was not ready and we are also preparing many other things. However it is hard to reveal that in such an early stage of development. Developers don’t want Diablo 3 to be PvP centered game, what they believe is the game is more PvE co-op heavy. [/quote]
Mr.Mag	2012-04-25 11:14
yeah, it's too expensive for blizzard. They would prefer to sell 100 million copies and then stop supporrting it. with 'living' pvp it wont be possible.
Mantas	2012-04-25 11:26
It's obvious for me that they don't want situation from WoW, where every major patch thay have to do loads of balance between pvp and pve/pvm. Imo it's easier to devolop a game like D3 witheout serious pvp. If they ever create a game for pvp enviroment it will be sth like LoL with pvp purpose only.
Pat	2012-04-25 11:34
Tbh, I have nothing against that as long as they give us the option for custom duels and let us make the PvP balancing rules like in the old days.
J	2012-04-25 11:55
so it will be looks like d2, good? bad? mhM :o
Spirals	2012-04-25 12:15
Yes  8) But for D3CL it means that we have to let the community grow and become stronger to prepare ourselves in the meanwhile.
GuN	2012-04-25 12:24
To be honest, sounds like expected for me. No ranking system, no semi eSport feeling, no real battles, just a fun "arena" with silly achievment rewards. They underestimate one thing, in my opinion. Items in Diablo2 has grown in worth and so is theire idea with the real money auction house, because of pvp build up a specific demand for those items. The profit will be a way under theire expectations, because of a missing or crippling pvp system. Id say, Diablo3 needs a GuildWars2 PvP System. Let the community balance or set rules, its so fucking easy. But they prefer to rule the world, instead of having less work, with real pvp fun.
Spirals	2012-04-25 12:30
Indeed Gun; people are willing to invest money into their pvp characters... if there is no serious PvP system it will be a setback for blizzard.. and for us :) Aslong as there is an arena were you can hostile we will manage our own pvp.
GuN	2012-04-25 12:44
thats why ive said some days before, we need to write a good post in the official boards or reply to blues. i think it doesnt matter at all, if pvp will need another year to be implemented, as long as they realize they took actually the wrong turn.
saesa	2012-04-25 13:06
Yes, if you don't write extended post(s) on b.net forums about private arenas, you can scrap d3cl because it will be worthless.
Mr.Mag	2012-04-25 13:18
most of players already did it but they know better... thats the problem. anyway I believe blizz wont fcuk it up. if they want to add pvp later, there must be a serious reason. i hope it'll be a random pvp arena
saesa	2012-04-25 13:21
I think it really needs to be a reasoned message. With links to PCL etc. So that Blizzard can reply. Not just random post. They should realize that they don't know better.
Mr.Mag	2012-04-25 13:23
hmm ok, i like this idea. it'll be a great promotion to us as well
Ajantis	2012-04-25 14:05
I've been active on official BN forums for quite some time and honestly, expect a shitload of flame from Blizzard fanboys if you want to emphasize the role of PvP. Blues should notice that though.
RoGH	2012-04-25 15:04
Tbh i care much only about custom arenas or an opportunity to simply host anyone you want - i dont need Bllizard's help in e-gaming. But posting there one hell of a topic about custom arenas/random hosts is important imo! Ajan maybe? :p
GuN	2012-04-25 15:51
full topic http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/4662897696?page=7
saesa	2012-04-25 15:54
As i said it is just a mess of contradictional posts about how d2 in was crap/fun and that there were rules/no rules, that hackers took over and so on. It's pretty clear people posting there have no clue about pvp leagues which we had for decade here...
GuN	2012-04-25 16:05
i absolutly agree with you, but the point at all is, how can we find a way, blizzard will recognize our wishes about pvp in a serious and mature topic. ive read nearly every post in this topic and alot of people trying to get into the "right" direction. i was thinking about a page with a collection of signatures. in the way of facebook "likes". and then promote this site via battle.net forum. in the way of "look how many people care about pvp". In my opinion alot of people wish to have a good pvp system, but i doubt they knew they wont get one.
Mr.Mag	2012-04-25 16:18
some kind of petition? i think we could do it even here. the best way is to list some main postulates instead of wall of text
RoGH	2012-04-25 16:26
We will run facebook page shortly ;)
Spirals	2012-04-25 16:28
I don't have facebook so I can't support anything there. I think it would be a good idea to combine these things. You make a stand here on this site as community with a list of main points and you back it up with a facebook page (linking to the site here)... and with that as your munition you hand it over to blizzard.
Mr.Mag	2012-04-25 16:31
accumulating hundreds of thousands of signatures on an unknown site will be difficult ;)
Spirals	2012-04-25 16:32
or maybe we should wait until the release and see what the options actually are. We don't know yet if it will be disabled completely and Blizzard is not likely to make a change in the game right now.
Mantas	2012-04-25 18:26
I think it will be similar. Only question is will it be possible only at arenas or as in D2/WoW in 'open' enviroment. I myself hope that they enable us both options.
ness	2012-04-25 19:08
It's imo pure business decision to not promote/support D3 pvp, to not make it viable tournament platform. They feel that success of D3 pvp may canibalize chances of their own DOTA game, which is currently under development and is afaik planned to be available in f2p mode. Also even though it's blizzard they don't have unlimited resources to work on 2 pvp titles. While DOTA-like games are not the same as diablo games pvpwise they share a lot similarities. And what's most important they share a playerbase. They don't want to risk and try to develop a competitive pvp game in unproven genre (h&s), what's worse a game that is not f2p like LoL, rather they are aiming to "steal" some ppl from LoL and upcoming valve dota, because that's a huge market already. Hopefully they will at least provide us with enough options to make D3 pvp manageable. We'll prove them wrong then :D
Ajantis	2012-04-25 19:14
Dunno about Facebook imho. I'd rather send a printed petition with some kind of signature scans of European PvP league admins or something like that. Way more serious for me. Posting that kind of stuff on forums would only make ppl spam how we don't know shit about D3 blah blah blah... We could do that, but I guess they will consider us as yet another bunch of random kids playing in Diablo 3 e-sport...
B4ST4RD	2012-04-25 20:13
You'll need huuuuuuuuge numbers to merely get noticed by Blizzard. You'd need to involve other communities, huge communities. Hmm you could try with d*****fans.com but their userbase is so retardedly anti-PVP you most likely will cancel it.
ness	2012-04-25 20:48
[quote]We could do that, but I guess they will consider us as yet another bunch of random kids playing in Diablo 3 e-sport...[/quote] And they will be right except for kids part, but it changes nothing here. What's the point of such petition now? To show that there are some ppl expecting serious pvp? Silly idd. Do we know what options for pvp blizz intends? We know that they are not aiming to make it 'balanced' and 'e-sport ready'. And it's not gonna change. Period. Be serious. They are multi-billion $ company not some indie 5 ppl team developer. Besides that general statement we know nothing. So, maybe just ask first on bnet forums and wait for reply. Was it asked already? What was the answer then? Afaik there wasn't any. They haven't reveal any details of pvp. Probably because they are still far from finishing it/they are considering their options, nothing is set in stone as of now. So complaining/demanding, sending some official petitions and shit will result only in being ignored or getting some standard PR reply. Because there's nothing else possible now. Cool down, ask on bnet forums, wait for some reply then depending on reply or lack of thereof think about other options. There's plenty of time after all. Several months or so. After all they're gonna reveal some details well before pvp release for sure. We might whine then. Now there's no point.
J	2012-04-25 21:37
Most of other forums, or all of them are anti-pvp. Maybe open pvp like on old d2. But its gay for us, jo? So richi u know how it gonna be.. :o
Ajantis	2012-04-25 21:57
True. That is why imho serious petition will be better than simple topic on their board. Besides, that was just an idea off the top of my head. Doesn't matter if you've been making Diablo tournaments longer than most Blizzard workers are emplyed in the company - everyone can make a simple topic on board. This is not the way you do serious business. Ofc, not that we are any serious partner for Blizzard, but still, we are EUROPEAN league and we represent thousands of players. If you want to influence them, forums is not the right way. [quote] Probably because they are still far from finishing it/they are considering their options, nothing is set in stone as of now.[/quote] They are finishing what? As you said, D3 will not be e-sport oriented. So what are they working on right now? Matchmaking? Please... The only explaination of their stupidity is that Blizzard is really trying to change Arenas into something serious. Maybe not really e-sport, but at least spectators or replays. [quote]Cool down, ask on bnet forums, wait for some reply then depending on reply or lack of thereof think about other options.[/quote] Reply from who? Blizz employees? They won't reveal anything, you know that. And I wouldn't really take into serious consideration fanboys on BN forums. People there scarcely have any idea about PvP.
ness	2012-04-26 00:07
[quote]True. That is why imho serious petition will be better than simple topic on their board. Besides, that was just an idea off the top of my head. Doesn't matter if you've been making Diablo tournaments longer than most Blizzard workers are emplyed in the company - everyone can make a simple topic on board. This is not the way you do serious business.[/quote] What kind serious business? And with whom? o_O No one there gives a singe fuck about any kind of petition signed by a bunch of randoms (mostly from eastern europe to spice things up) as we/you are. Damn, it's so obvious and trivial that I wonder why I should explain that. [quote]Ofc, not that we are any serious partner for Blizzard, but still, we are EUROPEAN league and we represent thousands of players. If you want to influence them, forums is not the right way.[/quote] You represent yourself and those ~100 ppl here on forum at best. You know that and they know that. Claiming that 'there's a thousand players demanding that' won't work because it's not true. If it was then bnet forums would be flooded with such threads. It's not. But let's even assume that they are thousands european pvpers demanding/expecting something. It's still states like a 0.05-0.1% of D3 playerbase if not less. It's so marginal that they could just ignore it. Most 'those thousands' will buy this game anyway and even if they start to whine their voice won't be heard. Simple digits. I could imagine that 0.1% of playerbase would like to see pink unicorns as mobs instead of all those zombies and deamons. Realistically. If you want to gain anything you gotta get some popular vote. How to achieve that? You need to sell that as an issue that would hurt 'casual' player. Pretty much nobody cares about "serious pvp" in diablo games. We know the reasons [b]but that's a fact as of now.[/b] But there are a lot ppl who would like to 'duel' casually. How to convince/persuade them (in this case for custom games)? "Dear Blue I'm a big diablo series fan. I love smashing mobs and doing boss runs. But sometimes I like to fight with/vs my friends. Will I be able to that in D3? I hope it will be possible." Something like that. 100 threads like that and maybe someone from blizz will respond someday. Casuals whining -> win -> SC2 chat channels outrage. [quote]They are finishing what? As you said, D3 will not be e-sport oriented. So what are they working on right now? Matchmaking? Please... The only explaination of their stupidity is that Blizzard is really trying to change Arenas into something serious. Maybe not really e-sport, but at least spectators or replays.[/quote] And why do you think that arenas will be only about duels/deathmatch/team deathmatch? Maybe they are developing other modes now. Ctf or some kind of domination. How can you tell? My friends' uncle works in blizzard answer does not count... You can't. You think you know but you don't know anything. It's only your wishful thinking. So that's only your assumption that they postponed pvp because they want to make it more competitive. And such assumption is complete against their statements where they said they don't want to make it like that. What's the obvious option left then? To make it more casual friendly, more accessible, more diversified or something like that. Sending any kind of petition/letter based on such assumption and claiming that 'we are many' and 'we want this and that' is just a waste of time at best, or even great way of making ourself look like a fools/retards who can't comprehend simple statements. It's just juvenile approach. [quote]Reply from who? Blizz employees? They won't reveal anything, you know that. And I wouldn't really take into serious consideration fanboys on BN forums. People there scarcely have any idea about PvP.[/quote] So if you think that they won't respond on forums to whole community there's even less chance that they will respond to some limited number of ppl asking directly. Besides. I wrote that in previous post. They are huge global company. When you deal with such company you gotta follow a rules that they set. You won't be able to speak with higher ups just because you want to, you won't get any kind of information before it is released to public because you feel that you deserve that because you are so awesome (pvper of anybody else). They got PR guys who filter all info that is released outside. When a blizz employee gives an interview there's always PR guy nearby who is keeping an eye on him. It works like that because - they can't risk any kind of leak of info that would help a competition and they can't release any info dealing with their internal matter to limited group of ppl because they are listed company. If you think that you can evade that then you are naive man and you are wasting your time. EOT from me on this.
Ajantis	2012-04-26 01:21
What I find funny about your comment is that you try to convince me that making topic on board is stronger than trying to use alternative ways. [quote]You represent yourself and those ~100 ppl here on forum at best. You know that and they know that. Claiming that 'there's a thousand players demanding that' won't work because it's not true. If it was then bnet forums would be flooded with such threads. It's not.[/quote] You're funny, dude :) Ever noticed how many players did play in D2 tournaments? The number of users registered or active on this board doesn't mean a thing. D3CL is a new organization, D3 is not out yet, ppl are coming back and will be coming back for the next few months at least. Funny, I should explain that to you :) [quote]But let's even assume that they are thousands european pvpers demanding/expecting something. It's still states like a 0.05-0.1% of D3 playerbase if not less. It's so marginal that they could just ignore it. Most 'those thousands' will buy this game anyway and even if they start to whine their voice won't be heard. Simple digits. I could imagine that 0.1% of playerbase would like to see pink unicorns as mobs instead of all those zombies and deamons.[/quote] So you assume that 0.1% of D3 players will play PvP. Risky statement based on pointless assumptions imho :) I am surprised I even reply to that ^^ [quote] "Dear Blue I'm a big diablo series fan. I love smashing mobs and doing boss runs. But sometimes I like to fight with/vs my friends. Will I be able to that in D3? I hope it will be possible."[/quote] That is why you will get Arenas and nothing more... Are you trying to tell me that such topics will make Arenas more professional? Or perhaps you just want to have Arenas as a suitable place for casual PvP player? Well, in that case wtf is ur post about anyway? We will get that anyway O_o [quote]And why do you think that arenas will be only about duels/deathmatch/team deathmatch? Maybe they are developing other modes now. Ctf or some kind of domination.[/quote] Dude, I feel tired discussing this with you... Afaik other types of matches have already been announced, so that issue should be left aside. And I guess you didn't understand me correctly and it is YOU who tries to force me to believe in your arguments, pal :) What do you mean by "more accessible"? Weren't Arenas already accessible? With its SC2 style matchmaking, no nerdy ladder and with typical geek achievements for useless shit? What else do you want? Or maybe: what else do you want, that takes next half a year to develop? Imho only serious functions such as spectator/arena editor/sth. I am sure you realize that implementing spectator function isn't that hard (or replay too). It wouldn't hurt. Besides, they would also help casual players. [quote]My friends' uncle works in blizzard answer does not count...[/quote] Dude, suggesting, that I would use that kind of answer really offends me. I assume you are one of those BN founding fathers, who used to play D1 back then in 1993, and your experience stands tall above every other person in here. Keep calm. I mean, I get that D3 is your whole life, but I won't cut myself if Blizz doesn't give a shit about PvP. Seems like it's far more important to you... [quote]Sending any kind of petition/letter based on such assumption and claiming that 'we are many' and 'we want this and that' is just a waste of time at best, or even great way of making ourself look like a fools/retards who can't comprehend simple statements. It's just juvenile approach.[/quote] The letter (which, I emphasize that, but seems like you must have missed that, was only a suggestion) would not be based on assumption that "we are many", but on assumption that "we have been organizing this for the last 12 years and we kindly suggest implementing this or that". It is not the number of users, who signed the petition (isn't thinking like that a juvenile approach?), but on the names of people, who mean something in Diablo community. You cannot gather fuckzillion of signatures, but you can at least try to emphasize weight of those signatures. Rogh's sig means more than some random kid's sig. [quote]So if you think that they won't respond on forums to whole community there's even less chance that they will respond to some limited number of ppl asking directly.[/quote] Isn't that obvious? I have also written that above, but you somehow didn't notice. I guess you must have been in a hurry, dude. Everyone can make a topic on BN forums. There are dozens of topics regarding PvP/Arenas/duels. Yet another topic wouldn't change anything. Sending letter/mail/petition/whatever is not that obvious approach. If you try to send a letter you at least buy the damn stamp and print the letter :) It takes a little bit more than just writing a message on bulletin board... [quote]You won't be able to speak with higher ups just because you want to, you won't get any kind of information before it is released to public because you feel that you deserve that because you are so awesome (pvper of anybody else). They got PR guys who filter all info that is released outside. When a blizz employee gives an interview there's always PR guy nearby who is keeping an eye on him. It works like that because - they can't risk any kind of leak of info that would help a competition and they can't release any info dealing with their internal matter to limited group of ppl because they are listed company. If you think that you can evade that then you are naive man and you are wasting your time.[/quote] Dude, you really are funny ^^ So you're saying that I cannot evade that by sending a letter or using some alternative ways, you I will succeed by making a topic :) Besides, who said I want to speak to higher reps? Dude, get a life, we're not 13 yo kids (I guess you think we are). It is just another way of drawing attention to PvP mode. If you think, that any of us here wants to get a private phone to Jay or go to barbeque with Bashiok's family, then I guess you're writing that pointless posts on purpose just to make me laugh, right? :) Srsly, calm down, get a beer or something and accept the fact, that there is a point in your suggestions, but there are others in here, who think differently. [quote]EOT from me on this.[/quote] Bye!
GuN	2012-04-26 09:56
Please leave the quote system ! Its horrible reading. Ness, i agree with you in most of your statements. But nobody said we should create a topic "we want our lolipop". Most of us are 30+ years old. Am i right ? So i guess we have a good educated mind and a mature behaviour related to such things. A petition was just an idea. The point is, if you want something changed in your life, then do something. If we would sit there and say nothing, nothing will change. Its just that easy. And of course we cant write a random topic, thats why we need a good plan, a good promotion and of course a proper and cool written story, why pvp is totally awsome and needy for diablo3. They wouldnt change the whole game, but they can change small things. Because of we discribe in a logical way, why those things are good and even better if we touch theire interessts too. Like ive said, the pvp demand, rises prices of items, high prices result in bigger profits for blizzard. I mean, they and we want one thing with Diablo3: Longlivity like we had in Diablo2 and of course fun with Diablo3. Nobody here said, Diablo3 sucks or these or those things are crap. We all have the same intentions. And you should try with your knowledge about blizzard, to work with us together.
Mr.Mag	2012-04-26 10:01
actually we don't need much. just a random pvp arena. i think it's not so complicated for blizz to do it. balance, leagues and so we can do on our own. i belive it possible to force this only one but most important idea
Karolus	2012-04-29 09:02
Here we have some info about PvP provided by Bashiok: http://www.diablofans.com/blizz-tracker/topic/221827-no-no-plans-for-duels-outrage/
GuN	2012-04-29 09:21
hmm hopefully the custom matches will implemented, that would be the base we need.
Icebergue	2012-05-01 17:21
It seems it will be good old D2 style :) first months will be spent learning the game and finding items, after that you can think on making rules to balance PvP / TvT if (for sure) it's necessary. D2 PvP was also about finding unbalances and exploiting them. Even if you were creative you could find something to give you an edge on certain duels. This arena however is pretty small but I'm positive there will be others to choose from.
Spirals	2012-05-02 17:04
In the movie (conclusion of the reveal interview movies) a question is asked about pvp. It's their toppriority right now to make it good.. they are supporting pvp for d3 and will make it good. Jay Wilson acknowledged the unsupported pvp in d2. www.reveal.diablo3.com

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